Or, The Saga of Two Canon R7 Kits
I have been using Canon brand cameras since 1971 when Jan got me one at the PX of the Incirlik Airforce Base. Started with an FTb, I have used well over a dozen different cameras plus more than that in lenses.
Lately, my Canon 5D Mark IV and its lenses have been getting harder and harder for me to carry around, and hold reasonably steady for clear pictures without motion blur. Because of that, I got myself a Canon M5 with its 18-150 mm EF-M lens and later added a second M5 and had it converted for infrared photography. In recent years, most of my photographs were taken with one of the M5 cameras and my 5D mostly stayed on the shelf as Jan occasionally pulled her 5D Mark III.
Table of Contents
Time To Replace the Heavy With The Light Gear
We heard that Mina, our granddaughter was getting into photography, and for a course she wanted to take at her high school, she needed a digital camera. I decided to pass my trusty M5 with a couple of lenses to her and get a couple of lighter, mirrorless cameras for me and Jan with lighter kit lenses. After doing some research, I settled on Canon R7 bodies with RF-S kit lenses, descendants from the one I have been using on my M5, 18-150 mm.
I have bought quite a few pieces of gear from our local store, Hunt’s Photo and Video in Providence. I stopped there one day, and the manager pulled out two kits with the lenses I wanted. After paying a fair price for them, we brought them home. That was about September 10, 2022. The last quarter of 2022 was a blur for both of us, and the cameras mostly remained unused other than the occasional investigation of the menus and features. They sure felt lighter and more comfortable, but something was missing from the pictures. I did not investigate much because of the health issues we have been dealing with.
Welcome 2023 and New Discoveries
As we got better, we clicked a few more photographs and one thing started emerging. The images were mostly not as sharp as I have come to expect from Canon after fifty-two years. Not only did they lack sharpness and clarity, a solid presence, but there would be a few sharp points that almost defied optical laws.
I called and spoke with a support rep at Canon Factory Services and he told me I could ship it back to them and a camera specialist would take a look and make the necessary adjustments. I shelled out close to $70 and sent my kit to Canon. A week or ten days later, I got the camera and the lens back with notes that they did minor adjustments and now it was within the Canon specs.
Well, Maybe The Gear Did Not Like Rhode Island!
For some reason, the kit might have been within the specs, but the images still did not show consistently improved sharpness. I even asked other photographer friends to handle the camera and take some pictures. The results were the same.
Then I tried Jan’s kit and found that although it was marginally better, it too suffered from the same overall problems. To test the focusing issues, I put the cameras on a tripod and shot a series of pictures of a focusing target made by LensAlign. It has a flat focus target and an angled ruler on the side. I carefully positioned the target, adjusted its height, and made the target parallel to the camera’s back.
When I focused on the vertical focus target, the actual focus showed farther back on the angled ruler. That behavior also changed, sometimes the focus moved forward depending on the f-stop or the focal length. I also learned that beyond f/11, the image quality was truly bad!
That made me write to a support person at Canon Professional Services who helped me a few years back and ask for help once more. Another person replied but offered to have both cameras shipped to Canon Factory Service and even provided overnight shipping labels. I shared a large number of the focus test shots for them to review as well. I was feeling a little better. But it would prove to be too soon!
A Camera Specialist Calls
Several days later, I received a phone call from a camera specialist. We chatted a little and he told me although he could see the focus shifting back, they recommend that customers do not shoot these tests as they may require better lighting and other arrangements. I also showed him that beyond f/11, the image quality degraded to unexpected levels that may be caused by very small f-stops. He said he would examine the cameras and call me back.
Indeed, in a couple of days, he called back and told me the cameras were shooting sharp images. I emphasized again that although I also got occasional sharp results, there was no rhyme or reason as to when the gear would decide to use their judgment! But, he said, he would ship them back essentially untouched. I asked if they could try different lenses or shoot the same scene on another kit, but that fell on deaf ears.
The Same Old Cameras
I was getting so discouraged by the lack of real support at Canon. I wrote a few more e-mails to the same support person asking for help. But to this day, they remain unanswered. It is hard not to wonder whether they were told to count on customers giving up with frustration. But my forty-plus years of teaching marketing told me that this was not right. Consumers should not be pushed around until they give up.
A Visit to Hunt’s Providence
My friend Dennis called me on Monday and said he would come and take me to Hunt’s Photo, Providence, where I could try different lenses to see if that made a difference. So we went to Hunt’s, and Alan greeted us after he was finished with a customer.
I explained to him the situation, and he took a picture of me with my camera and the lens. Viewing it on the camera back gave the impression of it being OK, but a little zooming made part of my beard and eyebrow fuzzy. I suggested that he put on another lens and try it, and the result was strikingly different. My beard was indeed sharp, all the way up to my eyebrow! Another off-the-shelf Canon camera and lens combination yielded better results than my kit as well. You will see them in the samples below.
Alan looked at the inventory and said he had one in the back and could order a second one for Jan. We quickly returned home. I got the camera box and other pieces of box contents and returned to swap my camera with a new kit. What a difference! Flowers were blooming again, with a sense of presence, clarity, and sharpness. Click one more, wow!
I returned to Hunt’s a few days later to swap Jan’s kit. When I came home, I quickly changed a few settings like file format, etc., and asked Jan to take the first shot. She took a picture of me; then I took one of her. We were not mushy anymore!
Thank You, Hunt’s; Thank You, Alan
A big thanks to Hunt’s Photo, Providence, and Alan for helping me to resolve this six-month saga of two Canon R7s that slipped through the quality control cracks that Canon refused to acknowledge. One more reason to buy your gear locally!
Ironically, these cameras will still go back to Canon. Will they stock them in the used, refurbished gear pile, probably without doing anything to them until someone buys them to face similar problems?
Support your local camera store; they help you save money and stand by you.
Show Me The Evidence!
Now, you would not think I would write this much without having and presenting the evidence, would you? I will share below some test shots of the focus target. I will also add photographs of similar subjects taken with two different camera kits, before and after. I will ensure no image gets any preferential treatment in sharpness or clarity adjustments and will try to present them as close to each other as possible.
When looking at the photographs below, observe not only how sharp they may or may not be, but the consistency of presence, clarity, and sharpness across the frame. You will easily observe inconsistencies of focus on the same plane and how the images lack presence. The first group will contain the “red” collection with flaws in the above areas and the second, the “green” collection will present similar frames with better results you can see and feel. I will also present a couple of them side by side for easier evaluation of close crops.
Unlike the images I generally post, these are larger and retain the metadata intact. If you are so curious, you may explore them. I will provide explanatory titles below each as needed. You may also want to compare the photographs in the Roger Williams Park post to those in the Stepstone Falls collection. I don’t know about you, but the clarity, presence, and sharpness in the Roger Williams Park photographs are strikingly different from the other set.
The Red Collection
The photographs in the red collection were taken with the original R7 kits. When you click on them and see the larger view, their titles will provide some additional information and where to look for abnormalities. If you want to see them a little larger, you can right-click on the enlarged image and open it in a new tab. It may allow you to zoom in a little more.
Click on the images to see them larger, uncropped, and read their titles.
The Green Collection
In this collection are the images mostly taken with the new R7 kit except for a couple. I tried my EF-L 70-200 f/4 lens with an adaptor on the original R7 body to see the image quality. At f/5.6, that lens offered me a sharp tulip where I focused in the middle. The second exception is the last photograph of my face that Alan took at Hunt’s using a different 18-150 RF-S lens on the previous R7 body. There was no comparison.
The others in the green collection were all taken with the new R7 kit with its new lens, including the opening photograph of the new R7 kit that Jan uses. Check the settings on that photograph, handheld at 1/80 sec, f/11, and ISO 6400.
A Comparative Pair
I pulled out the two photographs showing my beard so that you could go back and forth and see how much of a difference a tiny inconsistency can make. In the first one taken with my original kit, my beard starts getting fuzzy towards the middle and my eyebrow gets totally blurry. In the second one, all are in focus! How about that!
Another Comparative Pair
For another article in progress, I took pictures of simple things with the camera on a tripod. For the following examples, I focused on the pen nib. That image is a screen capture from Canon Digital Photo Professional with the “Show only AF points in focus” setting turned on. And the next image shows a 100% crop of the nib. Open it in a new window and zoom in. Does that look in focus to you?
Focus Target Samples
I have taken many frames with the camera on a tripod and aligned with the target. Below is a representative sample to demonstrate the series of problems. The Canon camera specialist tried to discourage me from photographing targets like this. I see no reason why. I focus on the vertical target and expect it to be the sharpest part, not an inch behind, or several inches in front! The images are cropped to the relevant area to present the problems in an easy-to-see manner.
And finally, another screen capture from Canon Digital Photo Professional demonstrates the lowered image quality at f/16 and how the focus target is aimed at the vertical target. Notice that the focus is nominally improved towards the front of the angled ruler indicating a forward focus shift.
A Message to Canon
Dear Canon,
We almost divorced after fifty-two years because you refused to accept your problems. I even borrowed an OM camera from Dennis just in case it came to that point, and I felt I had to switch. Marketing is fundamentally based on customers trusting you. Once you lose that trust, it does not matter how much better your equipment may be compared to the competition. You came extremely close to losing this customer had it not been the better customer orientation of Hunt’s. They fixed your problem for me.
In today’s market, practically any camera in the market that passes proper quality control will produce excellent photographs. Simply claiming your gear is better than others while ignoring consumer problems is a recipe for failure.
Regards,
A. Cemal Ekin, Ph.D.
Professor of Marketing Emeritus
James Turner
Excellent post Cemal. I too was rethinking my reliance on Canon as a camera due to the issues you were experiencing. In the end you reminded me how important it is to support one’s local business’s, in this circumstance, Hunts Photo in Providence. Their customer service is impressive. So, here’s to good images going forward. Not soft, nor forward focus without your intent.
A. Cemal Ekin
The evidence is out there, Jim. For some reason, Canon resists solving problems. I wonder if they read the post.
Cemal
Haluk Atamal
Dear Cemal, I am a religiously Nikon user since 1985.
I had once a similar problem with one lens 24-120 / f:4.0 which would refuse to close the diaphragm during shooting. That only occured when the lens was warm (via direct sunlight or due to Antalya’s summer days). I sent it under warranty for repair, losing weeks. Nothing was done and the lens was returned as “without any problems”, despite many mails during the time in between. Later I sold the lens much under its second hand price, openly (as we were educated that way) reminding the buyer about the problem.
I understand that our classical “museum” approach is no longer viable. I also appreciated the letter you wrote to Canon, still I don’t think they will bother too much.
It is a different world today, and it is getting wilder every day – too fast. I can also see it in the companies that I represent in Turkey: 20 years ago, they refused to sell unless there was local technical support. Nowadays they sell through almost every electrician round the corner, without worrying about the after sales service. “After sales service” is not a salesperson’s problem anymore; let the “dealers” worry about it.
If that problem was confined to Nikon or Canon cameras, I wouldn’t have bothered too much. But worse is taking place in the realm of medicine and patient care. When we visit a physician, it is getting harder each day to guess whether he/she is a good marketing person / an excellent sales person / a very good doctor surgeon.
We will be lucky to find similar “Hunt’s” experiences in the near future. They are indeed very precious (and rare) remnants from the last century.
Take care, do not worry too much and accept my best regards,
Haluk
A. Cemal Ekin
Haluk, you are so right about the changing world. This is not what I taught in marketing for about forty years. I owned two computer companies and if a device I installed did not work, it was MY problem, not theirs. An extension of everything you said is the willingness of the consumers to keep quiet even when they are mistreated, even defend the companies against their own interests. More consumers should speak up for themselves and for the entire society. The fabric is getting frayed and splitting in many ways.
Take care, and than you for sharing your experiences as well,
Cemal
Paul White
I use a Fuji xt1 or a n Olympus Om 1mirrorless cameras with very little loss of sharpness. I will switch to Nikon mirror less when I get the money. The problem with the Fuji and Olympus is they are cropped sensors. I prefer my large D3 or D600 full sensor cameras.
I also use Topaz AI Sharpening to correct some blurry image.
A. Cemal Ekin
We all get our fair share of unsharp photos, Paul. But, when the camera and its maker say it is in focus but the image is not, that is a problem. I am glad that I bought them from my local camera store and that they stood by me.
Take care,
Cemal
Sam Knochs
I bought an R7 one year ago, but have been able to use it only for about 1/4-1/2 of the year. The rest of the time it’s been at Canon getting repaired. I keep on getting a Error 70 message and the camera won’t take a photo. My local camera shop says that they can’t do anything about it except send it back to Canon, so off it went… again. I just got it back from repair last week! Canon replaced a logic board that was shorting out. I was hoping the store would give me a new one, they denied that request, but left open the possibility if it happens again after the camera returns from service. I’m so frustrated!
When it worked, I loved that camera, the 18-150 kit lens was fine, but adding the 100-400 R lens gave me some great wildlife photos, as well as wonderful rowing regatta photos.
A. Cemal Ekin
I share your frustration, Sam. As I wrote in the article, the support people respond as if they were instructed to push back on any problem claims hoping that the frustrated customer will give up. Like you, when it works fine, it is very enjoyable to use. The biggest source of frustration with the original kits was not knowing the trigger point. To this date, I don’t know whether it was the selected focal length, the f-stop, a combination, or shooting distance;… Some images would come out just out of focus in very odd ways. I wish your camera store would stand by you as mine did.
Lawrence Lee Huber
Lol, my R7 and EF lenses have been going beautifully strong for a year now on hikes banging around, wet and cold without a hiccup.
Amazingly sharp images with animal/eye AF finding and tracking amazingly well.
I know this article’s goal is to bash Canon but having gone through a 10D, 7D and now R7 with only 1 repair to the 10D after 10 years of rough use.
Prior to that EOS film and FD/FL film cameras with no issues again heavy use and banging around.
A. Cemal Ekin
Hello, Lawrence, and welcome to Kept Light Photography. Contrary to your assessment, the article’s purpose is not “to bash Canon” but to share the real experiences of someone using Canon gear for over half a century. As you probably read, I ended up with two identical sets of Canon R7s instead of switching to another brand.
No, I do not make baseless claims to bash anyone. The retail sales agent verified my problem, and he did what Canon failed to do. I have been using my camera with satisfaction since then. May I suggest not assigning motives to authors without fully understanding them?
Take care,
Cemal
Lawrence Lee Huber
My R7 is like yours, amazingly sharp with ALL my lenses and 100% reliable. At times I wonder about these trashing stories are actually by trolls jealous of the amazing R7 that is so far ahead of any Nikon or Sony product in its class.
A. Cemal Ekin
Lawrence, my only intent is to share the facts. I have been using Canon cameras and lenses for over fifty years and am not considering switching, nor do I write to bash Canon in general. However, the number of R7 kits having similar problems can only be a quality control issue. And, the service centers simply denying the problem can only be poor customer service. By writing these experiences, I would like to provide information to Canon.
I am delighted that your R7 has been working well. Ours are also working well after the replacement.
Take care, and happy holidays,
Cemal
Mark Landman
Great article! I’ve been going through the same thing for months … deleted so many great captures from a once-in-a-lifetime Pacific Northwest trip. I’m wondering what serial numbers your camera was; I think I might have one. I believe at this point my focus issue happens in mechanical shutter mode with IS not fully functioning consistently.
I also have a problem getting red artifacts in overexposed areas in night photos (most every star has a red “star” next to it). I’m wondering if anybody else is experiencing this.
Mark
A. Cemal Ekin
Mark, I am sorry to hear these stories and consider myself somewhat lucky. I do not have the serial numbers from the old kits, two of them. But I recall that they were not too far apart if they were issued sequentially. I am truly disappointed with Canon as a user since 1971. Have you tried seeking help from your local camera store? Mine came to my help almost immediately.
Best of luck,
Cemal
Miguel
Mark and all, I just checked this article and I am so regretful that I did not read it couple of months ago before buying my r7 and giving my D70 as part of payment. Btw I found this YT video couple of days ago, I have not tried it, but it seems that the mechanical shutter mode is the culprit in this guy view of many of the issues with not sharp images. It is so sad that Canon releases these cameras and does not address the issue via recall or firmware updates, or something. Here is the video, if it works we maybe getting a camera that is not able to work with mechanical shutter, only electronic first curtain or fully electronic . Disappointed ☹️. Sorry almost forgot the link
https://youtu.be/Z0erGS4dk-w?si=nmxCpDMTrz1ugZka
A. Cemal Ekin
Miguel, thank you for stopping by and sharing your thoughts. On the brighter side, if you have a supportive store staff where you purchased the gear, they may be able to replace your set with a new one. I have been using mechanical shutter on the new kit with no focus relate issues that plagued the previous ones.
Best of luck, take care,
Cemal
Miguel Rodriguez
My local store is not that supportive :-(. However I found it happens more with a old Wide Angle Sigma 10-20 EF, I got sharp images with a Tokina Macro and a Tamrom 70-300 zoom. So I guess I will try more with those plus the kit 18-150 mm lens and if those work fine most of the time, I will give up on the Sigma
A. Cemal Ekin
Best of luck, Miguel. I am glad you found a workaround already.
Take care,
Cemal
Steve Callahan
I also bought a R7 from Hunts, I’m closer to the Holyoke store, ordered it on their website and enjoying the upgrade from my 77D. Happy shooting.
A. Cemal Ekin
That’s very good news. Thank you for sharing your experiences, Steve. I have bought many cameras and lenses from Hunt’s over the years and have had very good service.
Cemal